06-29-2011, 01:15 PM
|
#1
|
GX Member
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 41
|
MAP sensor and adapter
I need to replace my 2002 3400 MAP to a 2 bar 3500 type. Does anyone have a part # and a source for an adapter to go from my 3400 harness to a 3500 style MAP
Thank you in adavance.
|
|
|
06-30-2011, 11:00 AM
|
#2
|
GX Member
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 41
|
Beuller....Beuller ?
|
|
|
06-30-2011, 01:44 PM
|
#3
|
GLS member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Tampa Bay, Fl
Posts: 1,127
|
since you are a fellow florida amodder, look up WOT-Tech, Ben just relocated down here to Florida
__________________
2001 Oldsmobile Alero GL Sedan LA1 3400 SFI V6
Nickname : Midnyte
|
|
|
07-01-2011, 07:16 AM
|
#4
|
GX Member
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 41
|
Thanks
|
|
|
07-01-2011, 08:35 AM
|
#5
|
AutoCross Alero
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: South Texas
Posts: 2,759
|
i got both the new style sensor and pigtail off of ebay, and made my own hold down.
|
|
|
07-01-2011, 12:53 PM
|
#6
|
GX Member
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 41
|
You dont remember the part # for the new style 2 or 3 bar do you. I can fab a bracket. Thank so much
|
|
|
07-01-2011, 02:02 PM
|
#7
|
GLS member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,319
|
I didn't think our PCM could support a 2 BAR MAP? In the PCM they top out at 140 or so I think. Is that high enough to support a 2 BAR? Also, if you delete the MAF these things go into SD mode banging gears at full pressure. This is why tuning MAP in the 3400 is such a bitch to do. You will destroy a factory trans mount in no time. If the car is not banging gears, you are not in the right mode to tune it, sucks!
|
|
|
07-01-2011, 02:51 PM
|
#8
|
GLS member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Fort Knox area, KY
Posts: 2,120
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by MMGT1
I didn't think our PCM could support a 2 BAR MAP? In the PCM they top out at 140 or so I think. Is that high enough to support a 2 BAR? Also, if you delete the MAF these things go into SD mode banging gears at full pressure. This is why tuning MAP in the 3400 is such a bitch to do. You will destroy a factory trans mount in no time. If the car is not banging gears, you are not in the right mode to tune it, sucks!
|
Not only the MAP table, but the spark tables get maxed out as well. I've got a post somewhere in this sub-forum that discussed that, I'll look for it....
http://www.aleromod.com/forums/showthread.php?p=516593&highlight=scan+graph#post5 16593
Last edited by AleroB888 : 07-01-2011 at 03:04 PM.
|
|
|
07-01-2011, 08:34 PM
|
#9
|
GLS member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,319
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by AleroB888
|
See, thats what Im talking about. So putting a 2-3 bar map on the car is pretty useless. That's terrible that you have to give up power due to a limit in the pcm with that table. What you have in there about it carrying the final value is right. Once exceeded, it will just hold that value.
|
|
|
07-01-2011, 02:04 PM
|
#10
|
636 whp
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: AZ
Posts: 11,902
|
You use HPTuners and scale the values. The transmission should be a non-issue as well, I would assume.
|
|
|
07-01-2011, 02:20 PM
|
#11
|
GLS member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,319
|
Mind posting a screen shot of your MAP table? I'm curious now. I have herd of the guys scaling the MAP, but never knew if it would actually work. This is why I am using a MAF in my install. I am using the MAF from a Cobalt/Malibu/Corvette so I can get a poper reading out of it all the way to max air flow....
Tables are available from the guys on HP now for whatever size tube you install it in and there is even a guy kicking there now that is making the Honeycomb to fit any size piping I choose to use, pretty sweet actually!
|
|
|
07-01-2011, 02:41 PM
|
#12
|
636 whp
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: AZ
Posts: 11,902
|
As you can see, I don't have a 3400. I don't need to scale any values because I have a 2-bar tune based on the GMPP supercharger kit tune.
|
|
|
07-02-2011, 10:54 AM
|
#13
|
GX Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: maryland
Posts: 181
|
the is it limited with an aftermarket device ? say a MS ? gotta get in touch with blkgagt on GAGT forum or ask milzy he put down 400 hp on the dyno and i am interested in seeing if he maxed his table out too AaronGTR is another good one to ask and he has plenty if scans to tell ya
Last edited by unchained01 : 07-02-2011 at 11:06 AM.
|
|
|
07-02-2011, 12:06 PM
|
#14
|
GLS member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,319
|
I know Milzy is running a piggy back that he designed himself on his. Pretty sure he is making it available to the public too.
|
|
|
07-07-2011, 07:37 AM
|
#15
|
GX Member
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 41
|
If I am only running 10-15 lbs of boost, you are saying that the 3400 computer cannot be tuned to see a 2 bar MAP?
Even with a third party software such as HPTuners?
|
|
|
07-07-2011, 12:22 PM
|
#16
|
GLS member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Fort Knox area, KY
Posts: 2,120
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackV6
If I am only running 10-15 lbs of boost, you are saying that the 3400 computer cannot be tuned to see a 2 bar MAP?
Even with a third party software such as HPTuners?
|
You can get by with a stock 3400 PCM at 10-12 lbs boost, provided your boost control is very accurate and fail-safe. The results won't be optimum, but still allows for pretty good performance. 15 pounds is pushing it past the limit, with real potential for damage, unless you dial back the timing.
I have not kept up with the latest stuff available on HP Tuners. Tinytuner may have more options, though.
|
|
|
11-07-2013, 12:07 PM
|
#17
|
GX Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Dayton, OH
Posts: 215
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by AleroB888
You can get by with a stock 3400 PCM at 10-12 lbs boost, provided your boost control is very accurate and fail-safe. The results won't be optimum, but still allows for pretty good performance. 15 pounds is pushing it past the limit, with real potential for damage, unless you dial back the timing.
I have not kept up with the latest stuff available on HP Tuners. Tinytuner may have more options, though.
|
We've ran I think 23psi on a turbo 3400 using 3400 pcm and map a few years ago . MAP isn't really crucial for boost since it's only used in case of MAF failure, just imperative that MAF is working perfectly, and well tuned.
__________________
www.milzymotorsports.com
1999 Z34 - 3800 Turbo - Under Construction
1999 Grand Am GT Turbo race car - 12.1ET on stock engine with 10psi!
1977 Corvette - LS1/LS6 T56 - Under Construction
|
|
|
11-07-2013, 06:14 PM
|
#18
|
GLS member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Fort Knox area, KY
Posts: 2,120
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by MilzyZ34
We've ran I think 23psi on a turbo 3400 using 3400 pcm and map a few years ago . MAP isn't really crucial for boost since it's only used in case of MAF failure, just imperative that MAF is working perfectly, and well tuned.
|
You can do that, but you would have a whole (missing) section of the Spark tables that could not be optimized, past 0.92 g/cyl. If any KR is generated in that range, you could not tell exactly at what boost level it occurred.
If no KR is detected, and acceptable WOT power is achieved with the limited stock timing table, of course that's workable.
But I think you'd be leaving some performance on the "table" haha, pun intended
|
|
|
11-08-2013, 12:12 PM
|
#19
|
GX Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Dayton, OH
Posts: 215
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by AleroB888
You can do that, but you would have a whole (missing) section of the Spark tables that could not be optimized, past 0.92 g/cyl. If any KR is generated in that range, you could not tell exactly at what boost level it occurred.
If no KR is detected, and acceptable WOT power is achieved with the limited stock timing table, of course that's workable.
But I think you'd be leaving some performance on the "table" haha, pun intended
|
Once you have a decent amount of power, it doesn't take very much to get past .92 g/cyl, so you're already in that region anyways. I had my laptop stolen out of my truck last year and lost a lot of the scans we had for people's cars over the past few years prior, but I did happen to find a scan of one of my race car passes, and it clearly shows the g/cyl exceeding .92 at 4000 rpm, just .891 seconds after launch. This is with the T67 and 10psi of boost. In this same run, you can also see it hit over 10,900 Hz on the MAF. The MAF I was using was a LT1/LS1 (aluminum) MAF, but it was running off a 3x00 pcm. I don't remember if that was with or without the mini-AFC, but pretty sure it had mini-AFC. If you have a value set at the bottom corner of the spark table, and want to modify it to be something else, you can always modify the RPM threshold and commanded spark after that threshold to command a certain amount of spark after whatever rpm you input as the threshold, but personally, I use this value as a spark-controlled rev-limiter. The bottom line is once you go past a certain point, spark is constant, but that doesn't mean you're losing power because of it.
Boost is pretty constant after you've spooled the turbo, thanks to the wastegate bleeding off any excess pressure, so assuming you know how much boost you've got the system adjusted to, you should know exactly how much boost you have when x amount of knock happens. I don't know anyone who has a boost controller who doesn't have a boost gauge of some kind to see their actual boost. Also the biggest chance of knock to occur happens not at max rpm, but at torque peak.
Paul, we use a custom mini-AFC to exceed the limits of the stock MAF. All of our turbo kits we sell for the 3100 and 3400 use the stock MAF sensor, and those that wish to exceed the limits of the stock MAF (which is somewhere around 350whp with our setup) use the mini-AFC we make to scale back the MAF frequency to give it more range.
__________________
www.milzymotorsports.com
1999 Z34 - 3800 Turbo - Under Construction
1999 Grand Am GT Turbo race car - 12.1ET on stock engine with 10psi!
1977 Corvette - LS1/LS6 T56 - Under Construction
Last edited by MilzyZ34 : 11-08-2013 at 04:03 PM.
|
|
|
07-08-2011, 01:39 PM
|
#20
|
GX Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: maryland
Posts: 181
|
Tiny tuner does support 2 bar map sensor
|
|
|
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
|
|
Thread Tools |
Search this Thread |
|
|
Display Modes |
Hybrid Mode
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:25 AM.
|