intake manifold options

[whiterider00]

as of right now, i have a stock 2.4l with cai and full header back exhaust. i have a set of secret cams on the way, and was wondering what is available as far as upgrading the plastic intake manifold. ive searched a bit, and it seems the HO 2.3l manifold is really only good with a lot of mods or boost. i found this intake (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1995-Grand-Am-Intake-Manifold-2-3L-Motor-/220771934784?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories &hash=item3367086240) from a 95 grand am 2.3l. its not labeled as high output, but it looks similar to the high output manifold, except it appears to be plastic.

along with the cams, i also would like to get a larger tb, if it will make any noticable difference. will a different intake manifold, like the one in the link, be worth it, or will it require extensive modifications? ive read that theres issues with it mating up to the 2.4l block. also, what sort of tuning would be needed for these increased mods? if it can all be done on a stock tune, then fantastic, but if i need to spend hundreds to get a custom tune, ill probly just stick with the cams and my current setup.

any help is appreciated, and i apologize if theres any questions i asked that ahve been covered before. thanks.

[whiterider00]

found this one (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/GM-2-4-CHEVY-DOHC-ENGINE-INTAKE-MANIFOLD-W-TB-7071-/190503298747?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories &hash=item2c5ae1a6bb) too. appears to be the HO manifold, but ill ask the seller for more info.

[sleepyalero]

well, after putting different cams in the car, isnt a tune necessary? (from what im getting your saying you will stick to the cams and you can run a stock tune.)

[whiterider00]

From what ive read, the secret cams are mild enough that no tune is required. At least in everything ive read on here and the upgrades site, noone mentions a tune.

[MMGT1]

I would keep the intake you have and replace the TB with something nice. Yes, a tune is in order to get the most out of it. You can run a stock tune but "to get out what you put in" you will want to tune it. Especially PE mode and shift points if you are automatic

[whiterider00]

Ill probly stick with the stock manifold and tb for now then. Im going to see if theres somewhere locally that can tune it for me. I really dont have hundreds of dollars for hptuners, nor would i hav any idea what im doing with it. Running it with the new cams and stock tune wont cause any drivability issues or damage tho, right? Just wont b at its full potential?

[MMGT1]

Correct, the PCM can adjust for quite a bit of varience. I would strongly suggest having a tune done when you complete the work. If you do tune it, have your tuner aim for a 12.9-13.0 AFR in PE

[whiterider00]

been looking for a tb from the 2.3l on ebay and cant find anything. the second intake i mentioned looks just like the HO 2.3l intake and its got the tb on it, so i asked the seller if he knew what size the throttle body was. he responded with 2 1/2in outer diameter. which is absolutely useless information to me. lol. i might get it anyway since it does look like the 2.3l intake, unless anyone sees a reason not to.

[Redog]

I've read that the 2.3 manifold LOWERS horsepower compared to the 2.4 manifold, but the 2.3 may put out more torque compared to the 2.4

[xXManwhoreXx]

..... A throttle body isnt going to do shit... Unless your intake is port matched your just making a huge bottleneck that is going to kill your flow... Get your intake mani ported out and bled the runner than you can get a throttle body that is the proper size.

[whiterider00]

well theres no point in porting the stock tb, being that its thin plastic. so id have to get a new one anyway if i wanted to port it. and if that ebay listing is for the 2.3 mani and tb, the tb would be the 56mm, and i would think the manifold would match in size. pretty much what i was asking is if anyone can verify if that listing is for the 2.3mani with the 56mm tb.

and to reddog, i have heard and read about it lowering hp. havent seen any torque numbers tho. i would actually be ok with a slight drop in hp for a gain in torque, as ive already lost some low end power with my header back exhaust.

[Oldsman]

Let's see been running 2.3 manifold. Cams and other mode for 5-6 yrs with no tune. You don't need a tune. Period unless going to 086 head.

2.3 manifold is better mid to high rpm range. Go with 2.3 tb and stay with stock manifold, you'll loose less bottom end.

[Oldsman]

Let's see been running 2.3 manifold. Cams and other mode for 5-6 yrs with no tune. You don't need a tune. Period unless going to 086 head.

2.3 manifold is better mid to high rpm range. Go with 2.3 tb and stay with stock manifold, you'll loose less bottom end.

[whiterider00]

honestly, oldsman ive been waiting for you to post something, cuz i knew you had the intake and cams. if it is really ok to run with no tune, ill probly do that for now. there is literally nowhere around here that does that sort of thing and i dont have the $500 for hptuners.

now if i get the 2.3l tb (56mm), wont the stock plastic manifold still be 52mm, and kinda defeat the point of the wider tb? and is that ebay listing i posted the 2.3l manifold and tb? it looks just like yours, but like i said, the guy gave me the outer diameter dimension, and has no idea what car it came off of, so i really dont know what size it is.

[Philbar71]

I have the 2.3 TB on my car. It opened up the mid range alot. from 2.5k to about 4.5k it really pulls. after that it drops off.

It was to my knowledge that all 2.3s had a 56mm TB. Just certain models fit better on 2.4s and such.

[whiterider00]

well, i contacted the guy again about the size of the tb on that manifold. he said the inside diameter is 1 7/8inches. thats roughly 45-46mm. that seems way too small, and i have a feeling he measured wrong or something. is there any way i can verify that it is the 2.3 manifold and tb, with out having to talk to the idiot selling it?

[[ion] C2]

..... A throttle body isnt going to do shit...

Not true, you're changing how much air is let in per throttle position. Noticed a huge difference in response when I put a 62mm throttle body on.

[zearchyo]

sorry for my ignorance but what kind of power gains to u get out of secrete cams tb and manifold:huh:

[whiterider00]

Ill let u know when i get it all installed. Im thinking around 15-20hp. Not sure tho.

[[ion] C2]

yeah about that

[zearchyo]

wheel horse power?

[[ion] C2]

it's just an estimate, no one knows because no one's dyno'd before and after from stock to those modifications.

it doesn't really matter. they're primarily supporting modfications to other things.

[whiterider00]

pretty good gain for under $200. now i just have to find a 2.3 tb and maybe intake. that guy on ebay is useless, and no yards seem to have 2.3l engines around here.

[whiterider00]

does anyone know if the throttle body on the high output 2.3l (lg0), and low output (ld2) were both 56mm, or just the high output? theres a couple listed on ebay, but they dont specify h.o. or not. and when i asked the seller, all he said was its the 2.3l tb. im starting to hate ebay.

[zearchyo]

seems like some i would be interesting on doing

[whiterider00]

wow, so much help i dont know where to begin.

maybe someone can answer this question then. are the tbs from cars with automatic trans the same as manual trans? theres a tb listed from 2.3l engine on ebay that says itll interchange with tb in a grand am, achieva, and beretta with a manual trans.

im really hoping to get the throttle body around the same time as my cams and whatnot, but i cant seem to get a straight answer from anyone on ebay, or any sort of answer on here. ive searched online, wikipedia (for what its worth lol) and some on the forum, but cant really find if theres any difference in the engines/trans. any help is really appreciated.

[whiterider00]

well, searched more, and found 1 response in 1 thread on quad4forums stating that the h.o. and l.o. 2.3l have the same tb. however, thats not really enough for me to buy one, just to return it if it isnt what i want. i wouldnt think there would be a difference in tb size on the same general engine, but who knows. is there anyone who has proof that the low output and high output 2.3l engines share a 56mm tb?

hopefully i dont sound like an idiot asking this question over and over. i had assumed it was the same tb on both engines, but there really is no written proof that i could find.

[Philbar71]

All 2.3l quad 4 engines have the 56mm TB. no worries there. Do you have a junk yard near by?

[whiterider00]

a couple, but none have the tb. found a cpl on ebay for $40 shipped. one has a 60 day warranty too, so ill go with that.

[Philbar71]

If possible, make sure it comes off of a LG0 Quad Four. Those are the easiest to adapt to a 2.4 because all of the sensors, vac lines, and throttle cables line up almost perfectly with the stock 2.4 tb.