Tons of white smoke [Archive]

[ion] C2

11-10-2007, 04:49 PM

Mom's Pontiac Montana with the 3400 engine is having issues. Rough idle, TONS of white smoke, when revved. Coolant tank looks like chocolate milk. Oil is dark, but dad says it looks like oil, although she just had it changed three weeks ago. No visible leaks, at least what my dad says. I notice it looks kind of wet on the left side of the head/block.

0201: cylinder misfire
0401: insufficient flow

LIMG? Or head gasket? Dad seems to think the latter, however I jump on the LIMG bandwagon.

01silveralero

11-10-2007, 05:37 PM

its definitely head gasket problem

Redog

11-10-2007, 05:39 PM

Yeah with those codes, I'd vote the head gasket

01silveralero

11-10-2007, 05:43 PM

Yeah with those codes, I'd vote the head gasket

i could tell without looking at the codes :)

[ion] C2

11-10-2007, 05:49 PM

most everyone we've called/talked to says head gasket no doubt. its leaking near cyl 1 allowing the coolant to enter the exhaust

gay. you know how hard it is to work on the alero's 3400, try it on a montana. it is IMPOSSIBLE to reach the rear spark plugs. IMPOSSIBLE without pulling the engine.

so now my mom's without a vehicle for quite some time, don't have the ability/money to fix it at the moment. they're talking about having her drive MY ALERO to work and back and shopping and shit. NO ONE drives my alero. and i need to monitor it as im throwing lean codes too, due to my tapping into the O2 sensor for my A/F gauge, as far as i know. hell my dad's even talking about selling my alero since it uses 93 octane and gas is going to get up to $4 a gallon very soon, says my car's a waste of money, no need to make it fast (i owe like a grand still on the car so its not totally mine yet)

this is bullllshit

01silveralero

11-10-2007, 05:55 PM

ion trying doing spark plugs on a buick t type without the right tools it is nearly impossible without taking off the turbo pipes.

[ion] C2

11-10-2007, 06:03 PM

hah, that's nothing, pulling the entire engine i think would be more fun to do to just change 3 plugs

anybody know where to pick up a cheapass car that runs? auctions? lol she needs something to drive

[ion] C2

11-10-2007, 06:28 PM

fuck this shit they're taking the alero

my mom works like in the fuckin ghetto too. every car she drives ends up getting fucked up, broken in some way. or she crashes it.

i have NO coverage other than medical on my car. so bye bye alero, everyone who has a nice one gets it stolen or fucked. this is what happens to mine.

AJules

11-10-2007, 06:35 PM

aw man, permanently?
that's bs, are they giving you your money back?

guess you're like me, I wouldn't be able to sleep at night if someone else was driving my car

but yeah, looks like you're the one who's getting the cheap car that runs eh?
anyway, what's gonna happen to the van? or what are you gonna drive?

[ion] C2

11-10-2007, 07:04 PM

not permanently but until her car gets fixed. doing a headgasket i just realized is a hell of a lot easier than the LIMG.

i'm not going to drive, they're going to drop me off at my college campus and i get to walk to classes. its not a safe area either, many get mugged. neither is my mom's workplace, so it'll be great having my modded alero sitting there like a BIG RED STICKERED UP sore thumb in the ghetto parking lot.

it's almost guaranteed my car will either be wrecked, jacked up, or stolen. lol. and i get to exercise on my way to class damnit.

TurboAleroGT40

11-10-2007, 07:17 PM

Don't think so negative bro.

rustyballs_69

11-10-2007, 07:19 PM

[QUOTE='[ion] C2;314446']not permanently but until her car gets fixed. doing a headgasket i just realized is a hell of a lot easier than the LIMG. QUOTE]

You have to take the limg off to get the heads off. Its not very hard on the alero but I don't know about a van, that doesn't sound fun.

[ion] C2

11-10-2007, 07:30 PM

yeah theres no way it would be possible in the engine bay lol. where it says 3400 SFI begins the body, so half the engine is inaccessible

CharleyO99Alero

11-10-2007, 07:48 PM

***

White exhaust smoke is always a sign of a blown head gasket. I know from past experience with a Buick 3.8 and a Chevy 350.

***

YALEROYNOT

11-10-2007, 07:57 PM

you could move out and take your car with you :haha:

[ion] C2

11-10-2007, 08:03 PM

haha i do live away but that would be an ass move, it's not like working one day a week at near min. wage can support me lol

my dad says most likely i'll get to keep the alero with me, either he'll get up early and drive her or something else.

RoetherB

11-10-2007, 08:05 PM

No offense, bro... But just get in there and rebuild the engine.

I have never rebuilt an engine (or even done anything more complicated than a tune-up) in my LIFE, and I tore into a Dodge 5.9L V8 Magnum, replaced every gasket, every hose, the radiator, water pump, plugs, wires, fan clutch... Basically the ENTIRE engine compartment in one weekend, about 16 total hours of work. Only help I had was my wife helping me wrap masking tape around wires to label them.

If I can do it, anyone can do it. It's all about how much you love you alero and if you can front the $100 for the gasket set. :)

-Brad

[ion] C2

11-10-2007, 08:08 PM

LOL i think you missed the content of the first post..

- this is not my vehicle we're talking about that has the problem
- i have the LD9 2.4L Twin Cam not the LA1 3400 SFI
- if my engine was having gasket or internal issues it'd be torn apart and back together within a day or two :)

this vehicle they wanted to trade in, i was pushing for an SRT-4 for my mom LOLOL. but it seems they waited too long to trade the van in because now this happened

RoetherB

11-10-2007, 08:08 PM

RoetherB

11-10-2007, 08:10 PM

C2;314463']LOL i think you missed the content of the first post..

- this is not my vehicle we're talking about that has the problem
- i have the LD9 2.4L Twin Cam not the LA1 3400 SFI
- if my engine was having gasket or internal issues it'd be torn apart and back together within a day or two :)

this vehicle they wanted to trade in, i was pushing for an SRT-4 for my mom LOLOL. but it seems they waited too long to trade the van in because now this happened

Right... You would want to rebuild the blown engine. Not the good one. lol.

....which is what I meant. :)

-Brad

[ion] C2

11-10-2007, 08:12 PM

Also, you mentioned you were in college...

When I turned 18, if my mom would have told me she was taking my car, I would have told her precisely where to go and how the hell to get there. Then, I would have handed her a bus schedule and a sock full of quarters.

Of course, I have a unique relationship with my parents. :)

-Brad

Hahaha. I would valiantly defend my vehicle until the issue is brought up that I haven't exactly paid it off yet. Dad bought it for $2500, I think I still owe $1500. Rather than pay off the vehicle fully, I decided to put a blower on it. Which, in retrospect, was a FAR BETTER MOVE. :) Although they don't think so.

rustyballs_69

11-10-2007, 08:14 PM

If its anything like the old astro vans you could pull the floor up.

Brad its gonna cost more than $100 for gaskets, its like $70 for the intake gaskets.

SittinOnChrome

11-10-2007, 08:24 PM

put sawdust in your radiator

[ion] C2

11-10-2007, 08:37 PM

um...?

TheEdgeofSanity

11-10-2007, 09:03 PM

ok, well, i still don't know if you are looking for a cheap car but look on AutoTrader.com -- there's a ton of malibu's and such in dearborn for sale. and, if that's out of the question, you could at least try to make your car looks as inconspicuous as possible by putting stock stuff back on the exterior so people would think its the average alero with nothing fancy on it. i mean, with the engine being covered, how will they know that u have any mods? tell your mom to park by security cameras or in a well lit area that isn't hidden from view.

01silveralero

11-10-2007, 09:06 PM

there's also craigslist, ebay or swapalease.com :p

[ion] C2

11-10-2007, 09:12 PM

yaeh i dunno, it looks like my mom will be driven by my dad until the parents snag some cash to pay a fellow mechanic family member to work on it, so i can keep my 'ho to whine around campus

[ion] C2

11-10-2007, 10:05 PM

lol so my dad says he's tempted to tear into the engine himself, as a Fel-Pro gasket is $23. says he was searching around online and says its not hard at all to replace the headgasket. says you can get at it form the rear of the engine (or the right of it as you look at it with the hood open)

how one can replace the 1, 3, 5 cylinder head by coming at it from the side is beyond me. thought you had to dissasemble the upper/lower intake manifolds and all that PITA

RoetherB

11-10-2007, 10:24 PM

Yes, in order to change a head gasket you will have to disassemble just about the entire top end. I don't think there is any way possible to get a head off without removing the intake plenum.

Also, don't just replace one head gasket. Not good to have the added compression of a new head gasket on just one side if the engine has any significant number of miles on it. You'll just blow the other side sooner. Even if the other side is not blown, replace it at the same time.

A full gasket and seal replacement set for a 5.9L V8 is about $140. Surely a V6 Felpro set will be at least a little cheaper than that.

Why don't you help your dad rebuild the engine? Surely you can give him a hand if he financed the 'ho for ya...

-Brad

[ion] C2

11-10-2007, 10:48 PM

its $144 for a total gasket set, or $23 per head gasket

ya... im sure that'd be a fun job, pulling the engine without a crane, tearing into it together. we don't do projects well together :p i think they're going to pay someone to do it, because doing anything on this engine is a real pain in the ass as far as i know. i'll take my LD9 and elbow room anyday.

RoetherB

11-10-2007, 11:38 PM

Don't pull the engine...

Unless you need to do anything below the block, it can sit in place for the entire rebuild.

...unless it's one of those setups where the engine basically sits under a little hump in the passenger compartment. Then you might need to pull it to have room to work. :)

-Brad

Redog

11-10-2007, 11:57 PM

Yeah I would say if you're going to fix the van, swap the engine

[ion] C2

12-07-2007, 07:28 PM

Ends up he had the dealer do it, though I always say NEVER take anything to the dealer.

Replaced both headgaskets, all spark plugs, and four ignition coils... $2300

Jferg2223

12-07-2007, 10:06 PM

wow..... a normal mechanic might have charged a grand for all that.

[ion] C2

12-07-2007, 10:27 PM

I know.. we had a family member mech who wanted to do it for $800.. but he kept pushing it off for weeks and wouldn't call back or come to pick it up even though he said he would.

Not sure why he didn't shop around. Then again I don't know of any mechanics around here besides Livernois Motorsports, who would have probably doubled the cost just because they enjoy overcharging a bit.

Vinalero

12-07-2007, 11:06 PM

You go to dealers under warranty, the rest is pure robbery.

troyertrain

12-07-2007, 11:19 PM

holy crap, is the van even worth $2300? i am assuming its a late 90's Montana, correct?

i always search autotrader/craigslist/ebay for deals on cars, and there are always some on there for cheap. though, you are still getting what you pay for (usually under $3k its gonna be a piece of crap)...

[ion] C2

12-07-2007, 11:22 PM

2000 Montana.. I agree the price was ridiculous. I thought he was going to use the person from his work who would do it in his shop for $1200.. Not my money though.. I tend to find the best deals before I go for something. I'm getting the RSM 62mm throttle body for only $100 (retail ~$300), got Eagle rods for $110 (retail ~$350).. hehe :)

Cliff8928

12-08-2007, 12:41 AM

C2;321213']Ends up he had the dealer do it, though I always say NEVER take anything to the dealer.

Replaced both headgaskets, all spark plugs, and four ignition coils... $2300

You know, it only has 3 coils.

And you don't know anyone who works for GM and could get a good deal on it? I thought everyone in MI could LOL!

[ion] C2

12-08-2007, 08:48 AM

I don't know much about the 3400, neither does my dad, the dealer said it had one per cylinder.

Yeah my dad used to work for GM, my aunt does, but my dad didn't want to get the best deal I guess..

-Alero-

12-08-2007, 09:56 PM

it has a coil pack with 2 terminals on it meaning 3x2 = 6

head gasket honestly not that hard and yes they dropped the motor to do that. not really that big a deal. you have to drop one side of the motor just to change a belt.